Interview with Peter Stefanovic - Sky News

PETER STEFANOVIC, HOST: Well, Labor is vowing to save penalty rates for thousands of retail workers as part of its pledge to ease the cost of living. The Federal Government will file a submission today opposing an application from big business groups seeking to cut penalty rates and other entitlements in the retailer war. That's in favour of a 25 per cent pay rise.

So, joining us now on this is the Employment and Workplace Relations Minister, Murray Watt. Minister, thanks for your time. So, this push by the Retailers Association is for some staff, this is how I understand it, is for some staff to opt out of penalty rates and overtime in favour of a 25 per cent pay rise. So, why oppose that?

MURRAY WATT, MINISTER FOR EMPLOYMENT AND WORKPLACE RELATIONS: Yeah, so what's happening here, Pete, is that some of Australia's biggest retailers, so representatives of big business, are trying to strip out penalty rates and other conditions like overtime, meal allowances, things like that from the award that covers retail workers. Now, we need to remember that the award is a minimum safety net that applies to all workers. And what we're talking about here is some of the lowest paid workers in the country. I know that the retailers are talking about this being managers and senior staff, we're talking about people who earn as little as $53,000 a year. They're mostly women, they rely largely on the award for their terms and conditions. Now, we don't have an issue with employers and workers and unions getting together and negotiating an agreement for a workplace that trades off conditions for money. But it's very different if we're talking about the award conditions, which are supposed to be a safety net. You would have seen we've worked really hard to get wages moving again. We're not about to stand by and let big business take these sorts of conditions like penalty rates on workers who aren't paid very much.

PETER STEFANOVIC: So, just to clarify, what do you propose would be the average pay difference in dollar terms?

MURRAY WATT: Well, my understanding is that a 25 per cent pay rise for someone on about $53,000, we're probably talking about a bit over 10 grand a year. But even if they were to get that pay rise in return for trading away those conditions, they'd still be being paid well below the average weekly earnings and they would have had to kiss goodbye their penalty rates. Now, you know, I think weekends in Australia still matter, it's when we gather with our families, it's when the footy grand finals are on, and weddings and people should get rewarded for working on weekends.

PETER STEFANOVIC: So, you think that they would stand to earn more despite the 25 per cent pay rise? They would earn more through those penalty rates?

MURRAY WATT: That's right. I mean, this would amount to a real wage cut if this were to go through. So, even if people were to get that extra money in terms of their pay rate throughout the year, they would still be going backwards because of the loss of penalty rates and all of the other conditions that these big retailers want to take away.

PETER STEFANOVIC: Let's flip the argument for a moment, given that there are these record insolvencies at the moment that you and I and everyone's aware of given tough economic conditions. A lot of that's in the hospitality sector. Businesses are doing it really tough. Does the award need to be modernised or amended or changed to get with the times?

MURRAY WATT: Well, for starters, Pete, I recognise that many small businesses that are doing it tough. In proportionate terms, the amount of small businesses who are going insolvent is not as high as it was previously, we've got more small businesses, so it's not surprising that more of them are coming in and out of business. But I recognise things are tough for small business and we've tried to support them. I don't have an issue at all with people trying to simplify awards. I recognise that they can be pretty complicated, but we shouldn't be using simplification of awards to cut people's pay. And if anyone thinks that people like Woolies and Coles are doing this to give their workers a pay cut, well, you know, come on, let's be serious.

PETER STEFANOVIC: Let's just wrap up on a different issue, Minister. Tony Burke, he's been accused by the Opposition this morning of industrial-scale seat stacking when it comes to fast tracking citizenship ceremonies on the eve of a Federal Election. Is that what he's doing?

MURRAY WATT: No, absolutely not. This is just more rubbish from Peter Dutton trying to wind people up. I mean, I saw yesterday Peter Dutton was lying and claiming that some of these people will be Palestinians who've been here for a few months. That is a complete lie. People have to be in Australia for at least four years to apply for citizenship. So, he's just lying his way through to an election. All of the people we're talking about here have passed all of the character tests, all of the other tests to become citizens in Australia. Many councils in Australia have an enormous backlog of people who are trying to get their citizenship. We're just trying to help them get the citizenship that they've already passed the test for. So, it's just rubbish from Peter Dutton.

PETER STEFANOVIC: I think the optics of it, there's a stench here, though, because it's so close to a Federal Election. Why do it now? Why not wait until after the election and then you're avoiding these questions because, I mean, otherwise it looks dodgy.

MURRAY WATT: Yeah. We've been working with council for some time to try to get more people through once they've passed those citizenship tests. And, you know, up until now councils have made good progress, but there's a lot more to be done. I mean, I know what he's trying to do here. He's trying to get people to think that it's certain types of migrants. The majority of the people that we're talking about here are either from India or New Zealand who have passed their tests, are ready to become citizens. The only thing holding them up is their council can't put them through a citizenship ceremony because there's so many people trying. So, I don't think that we should be making people wait any longer than they need to if they've passed all the tests to become citizens.

PETER STEFANOVIC: Murray, we will leave it there. Thank you for your time. We'll talk to you again soon.