Interview with Natalie Barr - Sunrise

NATALIE BARR, HOST: Christmas shoppers could be facing weeks of chaos as 1,500 Woolworths employees walk out over a long‑standing pay dispute. The union says workers are struggling to make ends meet as cost‑of‑living pressures increase. Now there are concerns the strike could impact dozens of essential items leaving consumers at a loss as the festive season begins.
 
For their take, let's bring in Employment and Workplace Relations Minister, Murray Watt, and Deputy Opposition Leader, Sussan Ley. Good morning.

Murray, how are you going to save Christmas? 
 
MURRAY WATT, MINISTER FOR EMPLOYMENT AND WORKPLACE RELATIONS: G'day, Nat. Well obviously there's a little while to go yet, and it's not unusual to have these kind of disputes when it comes to wage negotiations. I've seen the reports from Woolworths saying that they've got lots of contingency plans in place to make sure that supplies will be available. But look, I'd obviously encourage the parties to keep talking and try to work this out. It's in the interests of the workers at Woolworths to try to come to an agreement about their wages, and it's in the interests of Woolworths to make sure that their operations keep going, not to mention the rest of us who want to do our Christmas shopping at Woolworths - or any other supermarket, of course. So, yeah, look, I'm confident that this will get worked out.
 
NATALIE BARR: Sussan, we found them still talking and then Sydney nearly grinding to a halt, people having to change their plans, because the train strike was only averted at the last minute. What do we need to do here?
 
SUSSAN LEY, DEPUTY LIBERAL LEADER: Well Nat, first I want to say to the union organisers, I think there's a better way to make your point than making families feel anxious about their grocery shopping at Christmas. But secondly, to the workers, I understand you're going through a cost‑of‑living crisis under this Labor Government - you are, Woolies workers are, all Australians are - and this is because we've seen such poor economic management. And we were promised mortgages would go backwards‑ mortgages would go down, your cost of living would get better, you would be, you know, life would be cheaper under Anthony Albanese. I'd just like Murray to apologise to these workers this morning, because he's part of a government-
 
MURRAY WATT: Well, I think to be fair-
 
SUSSAN LEY: ‑that did promise that no one would be left behind, Murray, and look at this, this is really, really tough for Australians-
 
MURRAY WATT: I think-
 
SUSSAN LEY: -not just Woolies workers this is Christmas.
 
NATALIE BARR: OK, we'll let Murray have his say on that one, then we'll move on.
 
MURRAY WATT: Well, I think if anyone has to apologise, Nat, it's probably Sussan and the Liberal Party who have voted against every single cost of living measure that our Government has introduced. They've opposed our tax cuts for middle‑income earners, they've opposed the energy bill relief, they've opposed cheaper medicines, cheaper childcare, and of course wages are finally beginning to grow in this country because of the changes our Government has made. We recognise that Australians are doing it really tough at the moment, whether it be those Woolies workers or other people as well, and that's why we've thrown so much work at supporting people through cost‑of‑living relief-
 
NATALIE BARR: OK-
 
SUSSAN LEY: Nat, everyone knows-
 
MURRAY WATT: -and actually, getting wages moving again which are being opposed by the Liberals.
 
SUSSAN LEY: -the Coalition-
 
NATALIE BARR: Let's move to something that parents really care about, the Government has introduced their - because I think we're going to be to-ing and fro-ing there - the Government's introduced their bill to ban 16‑year‑olds from using social media; every family is looking at this one. But YouTube is going to be exempt after The Wiggles lobbied for changes accommodating access to educational content. Murray, what is going to stop a kid under 16 from logging on to these social media sites with fake age details; can you explain that one?
 
MURRAY WATT: Well, I mean we understand that there are always going to be people who find loopholes in legislation, but the point here is that this is world‑leading legislation; no other country in the world has tackled this issue in the way that our Government has, and I really hope that we get bipartisan support for this legislation, 'cause it is important to Australian families-
 
NATALIE BARR: So that wasn't the question. Could you answer, because we all know teenagers, right? And if you know them in the modern age-
 
MURRAY WATT: Sure.
 
NATALIE BARR: ‑they stick a fake ID in, and it's really, really easy, and then they're on to all these sites. How is your government going to stop that?
 
MURRAY WATT: Well, as I say, we acknowledge that just as there are kids who buy alcohol under age, there are kids who buy cigarettes under age, there are going to be people who don't follow these laws, but the point is that the laws do actually put an obligation on the social media companies to take steps to prevent that kind of thing from happening. These Big Tech companies are very innovative, they have lots of very smart people working for them, I'm confident they can come up with ways to do that.
And I think this is going to be really important next week, Nat, to make sure that we do see bipartisan support. This week you probably saw that despite their long‑term call for caps on international student numbers and reducing migration, Peter Dutton and the Liberals flipped they're position because they were under pressure from lobbyists.
 
NATALIE BARR: Yeah, we're not talking about that one today. Let’s just let's stick on the-
 
MURRAY WATT: I just want to make sure they don't do that again next week.
 
NATALIE BARR: I know, it's politics. Sussan, are you going to support the ban on the under 16s, and do you know how the social media companies are actually going to enforce this?
 
SUSSAN LEY: Nat, Peter Dutton and the Liberals led this from the get‑go, announcing that we would have a media ban for the under 16s; we said that in June, social media ban. It's really important, the legislation has been introduced, we're going through it carefully, we expect the Government to put the right measures in place to take the tough action-
 
NATALIE BARR: How do you reckon the big companies are going to enforce it, Sussan?
 
SUSSAN LEY: Well, they have to do what this legislation requires them to do, and there's an expectation of them to step up.
 
NATALIE BARR: They won't take beheadings off the net though.
 
SUSSAN LEY: Well, I hope that this Labor Government talks tough with them in the same way that I know we would.
 
NATALIE BARR: Will that work?
 
SUSSAN LEY: Well, we just have to get this right. It's not good enough for everyone to say that we have to get it right-
 
MURRAY WATT: Well we’ve gone further than that, we've actually got penalties.
 
NATALIE BARR: OK, so do you reckon they'll pay the penalties, Murray?
 
MURRAY WATT: Absolutely, we've-
 
SUSSAN LEY: I just want it done, I-
 
MURRAY WATT: We're going a lot further than talking to the Big Tech companies, we're actually imposing penalties of up to $50 million with enforcement powers to go after them if they do the wrong thing, and as I say, I want to make sure that Sussan and her colleagues vote for this legislation. Just because they've been calling for it doesn't seem to mean that they back it in, they changed their position this week on overseas students, let's hope they don't do it again next week on social media.
 
NATALIE BARR: Well, they say they're looking at the legislation.
 
SUSSAN LEY: Nat, Murray's a bit scratchy at the end of the week, he obviously hasn't listened to what the Coalition has been saying. We want this to work. We'll go through the legislation really carefully. We expect it to happen urgently and swiftly, and we do this on behalf of parents and children.
 
NATALIE BARR: OK, then we've got to work out how it's going to work. OK. Thank you very much. We'll see you next week.
 
MURRAY WATT: Good to see you both.