Interview with Jeremy Jones, ABC Capricornia Breakfast
JEREMY JONES, HOST: Well as we approach a possible election this year, we'll be looking at policies and asking if they are fair dinkum and if they're going to be making the impact we expect from them. We take a look at the mining industry now; and here's an industry that pays very well, but not all standing side-by-side doing the same work are getting the same pay. Fed up with this, labour hire workers at Batchfire Callide mine in Biloela last year successfully lobbied for pay rise, and got it. Now the Labor Government says Same Job, Same Pay changes are hiking up wages for labour hire workers to level out with permanent employees.
Senator Murray Watt is heading to Rockhampton this morning to tout the program, saying 500 workers have benefited. But how much are those wages going up? And is 500 a drop in the bucket considering more than 85,000 people work in the industry, many as labour hire? Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations, Senator Murray Watt is with you now. And Senator, how much have those 500 miners benefited?
MURRAY WATT, MINISTER FOR EMPLOYMENT AND WORKPLACE RELATIONS: G'day, Jeremy. Good to be with you and your listeners again for a new year. And it is a good new year for many labour hire workers in the coal mining industry across Central Queensland.
One of the big changes that our Labor Government has made federally to try to get wages moving again is to try to close the loophole that we saw emerging around the use of labour hire. Not just in the mining industry, also in aviation, in warehousing, in meat processing, a whole range of industries where we saw big employers bringing in labour hire to undercut the pay of their own direct employees. And as a result of the changes that Labor's made federally, there's more than 500 mining workers in Queensland who've already benefited - so labour hire workers in those mines. There's over 2000 more mine workers who've got applications coming to fix this as well. And in one case, in one of the mines in Central Queensland that has delivered pay rises for these workers of up to $60,000 a year, or about $1,100 per week. And what that shows you is that's the amount of money they were being underpaid by the mining company compared to the direct employees of that company for doing exactly the same work. Most of the cases that we found in the mining industry have resulted in pay rises of $30,000-$40,000 a year. So still a really substantial amount of money that really is helping people to deal with their cost of living pressures.
And this is exactly what we said we would do at the last election, we wanted to get wages moving again. For 10 years under the LNP, wages were deliberately kept low. They used to boast about low wages being a deliberate design feature of their economic policy. We said we wanted to get wages moving again and in a range of industries we're now seeing that happen, including in the mining industry.
JEREMY JONES: And there's been criticisms of the policy that it doesn't comprehend the value of age, experience, expertise and qualification. What's your reaction to that?
MURRAY WATT: Yeah, this has been one of the furphies that's been put around by the LNP who opposed our changes. It's important to say that - that every time we've changed the law since coming to office to get wages moving again, it's been voted against by the likes of Michelle Landry, Matt Canavan, Colin Boyce, every other LNP member in the Federal Parliament. So they like to talk about their support for the mining industry, but when it comes to the crunch in Canberra, they vote against wage rises for mining workers.
Some people have tried to make that claim that you've just put forward, but what it's really saying is that if I'm a labour hire worker working alongside a direct employee, I shouldn't be paid less just because I'm a labour hire worker. And as you can see from those figures, in the mining industry in Queensland, we were seeing labour hire workers being paid $30,000-$40,000 - or in one case $60,000 less per year. Not because they were less qualified, not because they were less competent, simply because they were labour hire. So obviously under our laws there's still the opportunity for people to be paid more because of their experience, their skill level, all sorts of other factors. But what we've closed is the loophole that allowed big mining companies and other big companies in other industries to pay people less simply because they were labour hire.
JEREMY JONES: And labour hire companies are incredibly important in the mining industry, especially when there are highs and lows when it comes to demand. What's going to be the long-term impact, do you think, for these companies?
MURRAY WATT: Yeah look, we've always acknowledged that there's a place for labour-hire not just in the mining industry but in other industries. There's a place for contract work, casual work, especially when you're talking about surges, you know, there are going to be times that companies need extra workers on a short-term basis to cover a big surge in work that's available and that's fine. But we shouldn't be allowing people, and big companies in particular, to use labour hire simply as a way to undercut the agreements they've reached with their own workers about wage rates.
The other issue about it is that if we allow this kind of thing to go on, it actually undermines the pay and the conditions and the job security of those permanent employees. If companies are allowed to get around the pay rates, they've agreed with their own workers simply by bringing in labour hire workers at a lower rate of pay, that makes the jobs of the permanent workers more insecure as well, because why wouldn't an employer try to cut their wages bill in that way? So really, it's just about bringing back fairness into the workplace and saying that simply because of the company that you work for, if it's a labour hire firm, you shouldn't be able to be paid less. All these changes that we've made to the workplace laws - and as I say, all of them were opposed by the LNP - we're now seeing wages in Australia rise again at a rate above inflation. When we came to Office, wages were falling compared to inflation. So the average worker in Australia now, across all industries, is earning about $153 more per week under Labor than they were when we first came to Office. And we absolutely recognise that people are really doing it tough out there. You know, it's why we've delivered cost of living relief, energy bill relief, cheaper medicines, cheaper childcare, bulk billing, all those kinds of things. But making sure that people's pay goes up is also a really critical way of helping them deal with those kind of pressures.
JEREMY JONES: We're approaching an election this year as well, and I guess the public will have their chance to have a say on if they do feel that things are better off and those pay rises compared to the cost of living at the moment. Announcements approaching the election, you're in Rocky today - are there any announcements being made?
MURRAY WATT: I won't be announcing anything new today, but I'll certainly be meeting with these mining workers who benefited from our policies to hear more about what kind of a difference that's making to their ability to pay their bills. I'll also be popping down to Gladstone for a couple of meetings later on this afternoon, so during the rounds of some of the main CQ places. As you know, Jeremy, I've spent a lot of time in CQ and I'm really looking forward to getting back.
JEREMY JONES: Is there any idea when the Aussies will go to the polls?
MURRAY WATT: Well, there's only really one person who knows that and he's the Prime Minister, Jeremy. And in fact, I'm not even sure he's made up his mind yet. So, you know, obviously it's going to be this year and, you know, it's due by May, so we are getting to the pointy end of the electoral cycle. And you're right, people will have an opportunity not just to sort of think about how they're going now, but also what kind of future they want for their families. And I think when we get to the election, there'll be a really clear choice between Labor, who has stood with people through this cost of living crisis, making that cost of living relief available. Again, every single one of those cost of living measures that we've delivered was opposed by Peter Dutton and the LNP. So we've had people's back to try to help them. We've more than halved inflation since coming to Office. And as I say, wages are rising again above inflation. So we'll have an opportunity for people to make a choice between that kind of positive future where wages are rising, a government is supporting people, or Peter Dutton and the Coalition who've already promised to unwind some of our wages laws that would see wages go backwards again. They've already said that they'll slash the public service, slash the services that regional Australians need. So I think there'll be a really clear choice for voters when we get to election day.
JEREMY JONES: Well, Minister, it sounds like campaigning has already begun. Thank you for joining us this morning.
MURRAY WATT: Great to talk, Jeremy!
JEREMY JONES: Minister Murray Watt with you there for Employment and Workplace Relations.