Radio interview - FiveAA with Stacey Lee

STACEY LEE, HOST:    Two federal MPs from South Australia and they might be in the Federal Parliament, but we like to talk about the state election campaign and what's happened on the campaign trail this week. Good afternoon to you, Amanda Rishworth, Federal Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations. Hello. 

AMANDA RISHWORTH, MINISTER FOR EMPLOYMENT AND WORKPLACE RELATIONS:    Good afternoon, Stacey, and also to Anne. 

STACEY LEE:    And yes, good afternoon to you Senator Anne Ruston, Shadow Minister for Health. 

ANNE RUSTON, SHADOW HEALTH MINISTER:    Hi, both of you. 

STACEY LEE:    Thank you both for your time today. Let's start with transport because this has been a big one this week. The Greens announced a policy to return trains to Mount Barker. I speculated if we're going to do it to Mount Barker, why wouldn't you extend it to Murray Bridge, given the housing developments that are planned for Murray Bridge as well? Minister Rishworth, I might start with you. Many are saying that Labor will win this election and speculating they could even win the next election as well in 2030. Wouldn't this be the time for big picture thinking to fix a serious problem?

AMANDA RISHWORTH:    Well look, absolutely, Stacey. In terms of making sure that Mount Barker and places like those get access to public transport, it is really, really important. And that's why I understand that the Government, the State Government, has been looking at investing in buses, et cetera. But it takes a lot than one sheet of paper to develop something as big as a rail network. And it's very costly, and I'm not sure that the Greens have fully costed the cost of what it would take. Of course, public transport is really important, but I think you've also got to be conscious of the cost of things and the cost of infrastructure such as this.

STACEY LEE:    And it would be expensive, I think the Greens said $700 million. The Treasurer, Tom Koutsantonis, suggested it would be $1 billion when he spoke to Graeme Goodings this week. So we're not talking small change here, but I'd suggest there are lots of people in the hills and beyond who would say, well, it's worth it. You're upgrading South Road for residents in that area so they can get from North-South Corridor. Why aren't we getting trains? Anne Ruston, I might bring you in here because obviously the Liberal Party can't campaign as if the election is decided. But wouldn't this be a great time as an opposition who is not expected to win, wouldn't this be a good time for them to look at a big commitment like this? If not just to put pressure on the State Government to act? 

ANNE RUSTON:    Well, first of all, I wouldn't write us off just yet. We've got a fantastic leader and a fantastic team and they're out there, I've got to say, prosecuting all the real issues that matter to South Australians at the moment. So I'm not going to accept the premise that you think you've written us off already. But I do think there is a broader issue here, and that's about long-term planning for growth in our communities. And part of that clearly has to be an integrated urban development planning process, and that includes transport. But the reality is that we see this often with the Greens. They come up with great headlines that sound fantastic, and of course, you know, putting in train infrastructure to Mount Barker and then through to Murray Bridge or whatever it happens to be might sound great. But there's a lot of work that has to sit behind it to understand where the rail is going to go, how much it's going to cost, what the cost-benefit analysis is, what's the environmental impact, et cetera, et cetera. So I think coming up with thought bubbles in election campaigns are not the way the major parties approach this. And if that's the way the Greens want to do it, well, that's fine. But I think this is part of a broader planning process that needs to be undertaken because if we are going to have growth corridors like the one that we're talking about at the moment, it needs an integrated plan. And I know Ashton understands that very much as our leader. But putting in some temporary measures like the Dutton Park ‘n’ Ride to make sure that you are actually maximising the efficiency of your transport system. Obviously our 50 cent bus fares understand the cost of living pressures on South Australians at the moment, but we're talking about dealing with the short term issues but at the same time this does require longer term integrated planning. 

STACEY LEE: Speaking of longer term planning, ramping figures have been released for last month. For February, patients in SA spent 3,616 hours on a ramp instead of in a hospital. Do you think that it's time South Australians accepted ramping can't be fixed? Anne Ruston, is this just too big of a problem? Has it got way out of hand now and it's just a problem that we have to live with?

ANNE RUSTON:    No, not at all. Absolutely not at all. And I don't think that we should give up on this. I mean, it's really disappointing that the key promise of the Malinauskas opposition going into the 2022 election was that they were going to fix ramping. And as you point out, we're 100,000 hours worse off as we're standing here today in the lead up to the election. But there are many things that could be done. I mean, some are the failure of the Federal Government as well. I mean, the fact that we have failed dismally on aged care and we're seeing older Australians stuck in hospital beds when they don't need to be there. And that's all part of the chain of events that means people are sitting on ramps. The fact that we've failed our primary care system in terms of access to GPs. And we find out today the much promised urgent care clinics are not open for the hours that they were promised to be open. I mean, these were supposed to be taking pressure off our emergency departments and they quite clearly aren't from the interim report that we've seen on them. They're saying that there's no clear evidence that wait times have changed since they came into being. But, I mean, I think the fact that Peter Malinauskas- you couldn't even find him, he was always at a health press conference talking about ramping, standing next to Ash the Ambo, leading into 2022. He runs from any press conference when it comes to confronting the issues around ramping and health in South Australia 

So I don't think we should give up on ramping. I think we should get serious about it. But if you're going to get serious about it, you can't just talk about it. You've actually got to do something. And I think both the Malinauskas Government and the Albanese Government have let South Australians down when it comes to access to healthcare.

AMANDA RISHWORTH:    Well I think I probably need to respond to that.

STACEY LEE:    Minister Rishworth, yeah, I think you might want to respond.

AMANDA RISHWORTH:    I mean, firstly, I would say that, of course, meeting the health demands of our community is critically important. One thing I will agree with Anne is we shouldn't be giving up on it, but demand has gone up. And that is why you've seen both the Malinauskas Government and the Albanese Government rebuilding after the complete neglect of Liberal Government. So when you come, there's been a huge amount of effort putting into building more beds and more capacity at hospitals. Just been the agreements between the state and federal governments of $25 billion into hospitals. So this does take a huge amount of effort, but it does involve looking at different models of care as well, different ways to do things. When I heard Anne cherry pick some figures about the urgent care clinics - this is a new model of care, which was not even thought about by the Liberal Party. It has now seen around a 10 per cent reduction in emergency department presentations. And in in South Australia seen over 150,000 presentations. I mean, we're building the number and working up, but we will have to look at new ways of care. 1-800-MEDICARE is also a new type of service so you can speak to a doctor over the phone. So, we will need to look at different models of care as we meet what patients and people need. But the amount of money going into it is really significant, and we need to keep working on the issue. And both the Federal and State government has been putting really significant effort and more money than ever before into our health and hospital system. 

STACEY LEE:    And you're right, there are more beds coming online. Every, I think, second week we would hear about an extra 20 beds here, an extra 18 beds here, an extra ward here. It just doesn’t- it just hasn't had an impact. The one number that has increased is also the number of aged care residents waiting in hospital beds, which we keep being told is a federal matter. Is this something that, I guess, the Federal Government - to get off the state election campaign trail for a second, Minister, if I can - is the Federal Government coming up with a proper plan for that? Because I know it's not just an issue here in South Australia, it's nationwide but, obviously, we care about our own beds right now. 

AMANDA RISHWORTH:    Absolutely.

STACEY LEE:    Is this something that you'll have a plan on soon to try and get those residents out? 

AMANDA RISHWORTH:    We do have a plan. And one of the things I would point out is that there was a Royal Commission into Aged Care and it was titled Neglect, and that was under the previous Morrison government. We're now reforming our aged care system with more support at home to keep people in their own home, supporting people and supporting the investment into aged care facilities. And of course, the state government is complementing that with their work that they're doing with, for example, their vision for the old Women's and Children's Hospital becoming an aged care precinct. We've got to remember that we do have an ageing population, and we need to be working really hard to support and ensure that that ageing population gets the care. But this doesn't happen overnight. This has been decades of neglect, and so, both governments are working very hard to make sure that we're addressing this issue. 

STACEY LEE:    Anne Ruston, I might just return to you on this matter before we move on to housing. Health is a really hard one, I think, for an Opposition to campaign on, especially after the last election because it is a really tough portfolio to make promises on and know that you'll be able to deliver given the Malinauskas Government's failure to deliver on their key election promise - you would know that as Shadow Health Minister. So how can, as an Opposition wanting to win government, how can you make solid commitments in health given that recent history of how hard it is to make good on them? 

ANNE RUSTON:    Well, the first thing I'd say is the one really disappointing thing that we've seen of successive elections federally is the preparedness of the Labor Government to tell flat-out lies about the Coalition and Medicare. I mean, everyone's heard the term Medi-scare. We all saw the Prime Minister running around with his Medicare card saying that all you need is your Medicare card when you visit the doctor. But, I mean, your listeners will know that the reality is when they turn up to see their doctor, they're paying out-of-pocket costs and they're paying more than they've ever paid for the amount of money. I mean, it's over $50 on average for people when they go and see their GP. But I think it is, it’s incumbent on everybody to be honest. If you have a look at the Labor Party's aged care reforms that the Minister's just talked about, that came into effect about four months ago, they are failing before our eyes at the moment. I mean, last year we only saw 800 new aged care beds built against a demand of 10,000. I mean, we are talking about successive failures in delivering this. Not one new aged care package was released into the community for three months last year, despite the fact that we've got nearly a quarter of a million older Australians waiting to receive care, aged care. More than half of those have been assessed by the Government as needing care, and the Government's withholding care from them. And when they eventually do get their packages some 10 months, sometimes 12 months, after they've been assessed, they're only getting 60 per cent of the value of the care they've been assessed as needing. So I think we have to be realistic about the fact that there are failures going on in our health system, failures going in our aged care system. And I'm not going to shy away, even though I'm in Opposition, from calling them out every single day. Because I think that Australians deserve access to healthcare when they need it and older Australians need access to their aged care when they need it. 

AMANDA RISHWORTH:    Well, I think, Anne, you should be taking responsibility for your government. You need to, Anne, take responsibility for your previous government's failures. We are investing more in our health and our aged care system. As I said, there was a Royal Commission that said that there was neglect happening. So, to be honest, if you're going to be honest, you need to take responsibility for the failures that your government presided over - if you're going to be honest with the people of South Australia.

ANNE RUSTON:    I'd be really interested to know when the Labor Government is going to stop blaming the previous Coalition for everything and actually start to take some responsibility for some of the actions. You've been in government now for four years. It's about time you started taking responsibility that this is happening on your watch. Wait lists have blown out on your watch. Wait times have blown out on your watch. Older Australians dying waiting for care has increased under your watch. Ramping, as you know, is up under your watch. 

AMANDA RISHWORTH:    Many of those things suggest that we’re rebuilding a health system that was left absolutely in disarray and it takes some time. We're investing records amounts of money into it, much more than your previous government ever did. So we can keep having this debate. I doubt we're going to find an area of agreement here. 

STACEY LEE:    And this is probably where I'll step in and say it's turned to federal matters, and we probably didn't intend on it going there and it means we have run out of time, unfortunately. I'd love to keep chatting. I'm sure both of you would as well. But we can do it all again next week and we'll revisit housing next week. Because no doubt, one or both of the major parties will make a housing announcement for the state election in that time as well. So, for now, I appreciate both of your times this afternoon, and have a great long weekend. Happy International Women's Day for tomorrow as well. 

AMANDA RISHWORTH:    You too. 

ANNE RUSTON:    Yeah. Thanks to you and all your listeners as well.