Doorstop Interview - Adelaide

CLAIRE CLUTTERHAM, MEMBER FOR STURT: Good morning everyone, my name is Claire Clutterham, I'm the Member for Sturt in the Federal Parliament and we are here on the northern border of Sturt this morning at Oakden Rise, which is a property development by Villawood Properties. 

I'm joined this morning by Andrew Giles, the Federal Minister for Skills and Training, Blair Boyer, the South Australian Minister for Education and Skills, Dana Wortley, the current member for Torrens in the State Parliament and Meagan Spencer, Labor's fantastic candidate for Torrens in the forthcoming state election. 

And I'm also pleased to be joined by Justin Busse, representing TAFE SA. Now, we are here this morning to make further announcements regarding the Albanese and Malinauskas Labor Government's commitment to skills. 

In South Australia, we are booming. We have the Osborne Defence Precinct, Torrens to Darlington, we have housing developments, the Women's and Children's Hospital. We need skilled workers, and we don't have skilled workers unless we have investment in trainers and teachers and that's what we're here to talk about this morning. 

So I'll pass over to Andrew Giles, the Minister for Skills to tell us more.

ANDREW GILES, MINISTER FOR SKILLS AND TRAINING: Thanks very much Claire and as all of my Adelaide based colleagues have told me this is a typical Adelaide, not Melbourne, October day and it's great to be here in the Labor electorate of Sturt. 

And Claire, thank you for that introduction and thank you more so for the extraordinary impact you've already had in your short time in Federal Parliament. Standing up for your constituents, but also having a real impact on national issues too. I'm also pleased to be here with so many colleagues from the Malinauskas Government the current member for Torrens and the Labor candidate for Torrens. 

I'm also here, of course, with my friend Blair Boyer, the South Australian Minister who we’ll hear from in a minute. Now, when the Albanese Government came into office, we were confronted by Australia's worst skills shortage in half a century. And that's been biting particularly hard here in South Australia for all of the reasons Claire has just articulated. 

So our focus in the Commonwealth has been working closely with the Malinauskas Government to build solutions to this skills crisis. To get more tradies up and running. Free TAFE has of course been a runaway success. We've been focusing on apprenticeships. 

But one thing that we know is that to create more tradies, we need more trades teachers. And that's what today's announcement is fundamentally about.

It's a shared investment between the Albanese and the Malinauskas Governments of more than $10 million. And it's about attraction and retention of our TAFE and VET workforce. 

These extraordinary people who are generating tradespeople of the future so that we can build more houses like the ones behind us, and deliver on all those other national objectives that are so pressing right here in Adelaide and around South Australia right now. 

I just want to talk a little bit about what this $10 million investment means, before handing over to Blair. Because as I say, it's about attraction and it’s about retention too. What this will do, through scholarships and innovative pathways programs, is deliver 300 more new TAFE teachers and trainers.

Three hundred more people training the tradies of the future. And this is going to have a particular focus on those areas of [indistinct] shortage, construction and electrical in particular. Making sure that young and not-so-young South Australians who want to pick up the tools and become a tradie are not held back by having to wait for their trades training.

We’re also focusing on valuing our [indistinct] workforce, and this investment will also enable professional development, enabling people to upskill if they’ve been in the trades, training in the space for a while, or get them mentoring and other supports to stay in the space, so that they can really build a career, a satisfying, well rewarded career. 

And we’re investing in our future by allowing us to build more tradies. So Blair, this partnership we have [indistinct] between our governments, the governments led so well by Prime Minister Anthony Albanese and Premier Peter Malinauskas is all about delivering. It’s all about delivery here for the people of South Australia. 

Good training, good jobs to deliver on our shared national and South Australian objectives. So, Blair, over to you.

BLAIR BOYER, SOUTH AUSTRALIAN MINISTER FOR EDUCATION, TRAINING AND SKILLS: Thanks very much, Andrew. And it's great to be here to announce another partnership between the Albanese and Malinauskas Governments around training and around TAFE. 

In the next five years, South Australia needs an additional 78,000 VET-trained members of the workforce. That is an incredibly high number given the size of our state. It's a huge challenge, but it's also an enormous opportunity, particularly for young South Australians who might be in high school now who are making decisions around what they're going to do when they leave high school. 

Of course the challenge, though, at the moment is in terms of making sure that we've also got the workforce to train those 78,000 new trained workers who will be working on projects like the one behind me now, is that the money on the tools, the opportunities on the tools are probably better than they have ever been. 

So we need to do more to attract people to come off the tools and choose to be a trainer or a lecturer, and play their role in training that next generation of tradespeople.

That’s why we’ve announced this today, with $10 million being announced shared between the Malinauskas and Albanese Governments, it’s so important. 

This is around incentives through scholarships and other means as well, to get people off the tools so they’ve got that recent experience on site, and be the next lecturer or trainer who will make sure that we can meet the target that we’ve got of reaching that 78,000 additional VET-trained workers in South Australia across the next five years. 

And I can tell you some of the projects that they would be able to work on. We’re talking about AUKUS, [indistinct] non-stop North-South Motorway, thousands of homes like the one here from Villawood. Even in my own portfolio areas, the delivery of three-year-old preschool, a second year of preschool before kids start primary school. 

They all share exactly the same challenges, all those big projects. And that challenge is, where do we get the workers to deliver it.

Now, of course, we only fully realise the benefit of having things like AUKUS and building things like a New Women’s and Children’s Hospital, and offering a second year of [indistinct] play-based learning in preschool, if we can give as many of those job opportunities as we possibly can for South Australians. 

Now part of that is making sure that they get the opportunities to get the skills they need to get the job, and we have partnered in that to record levels with Fee-Free TAFE, but it's also about making sure there is a well-trained lecturer or trainer standing in front of their class who not only has the expertise but has recent experience in the industry as well. 

I'm constantly hearing from people who are doing an apprenticeship or a traineeship that they want to be taught by someone who's been in the industry that they are pursuing recently so they know the skills they are learning are going to be relevant and be up to date.

That's why this announcement today of all these scholarships of $10 million between the two governments to go towards incentivising more people to come off the tools and be a trainer I think is so incredibly important. 

I'm really proud to have Andrew here again. He's been to Adelaide on a lot of occasions since taking over these portfolios. We have a real shared interest, I think, between the federal and state governments in not only tackling, as Andrew said, the biggest skills shortage and skills crisis that we've had in about 50 years, but turning what is a big problem into a big opportunity. 

This is a big opportunity. As the Premier of this state says almost every day, you don't need to go to university to have a great career, and that has never been more true. 

But our job as government is to make sure it's real, and to make sure we give all South Australians, no matter where they live and no matter where they go to school, the opportunity to get the qualifications they need, to get the job that is there waiting for them. 

Anyone else want to say anything? Happy to take questions on this or anything else you might have.

JOURNALIST: Blair, you said that it’s $10 million to be spread across building, early childhood, defence and health. How are you going to split that money? And how much is going to go to the building industry?

BOYER: I think there will be a lot that will go to building and construction. I can't tell you exactly how much because we're going to open up for interest, I will see what kind of interest we get from different areas. 

But $10 million is a big chunk. And it's important, I think, to remember too that we've already got some of the courses that are relevant the industry and the work that's taking place behind us today on the Fee-Free TAFE list. 

But this scholarship is really important because what we are constantly hearing from those, say, tradies who might have 10 years ago been really keen to come and work for TAFE or another training provider are saying the money's too good on the tools. 

Why would I move and go and do that? And our way of bridging that is through scholarships like this. So there's a financial incentive for them to, say, get off the tools and come and train the next generation of workers.

JOURNALIST: And I imagine some of the, this might be a better question for TAFE, but some of the more experienced builders, they're retiring, and it’s hard to find these experienced builders to teach people.

BOYER: No, that’s bang on. One of the things I hear from the Master Builders particularly, and from TAFE too, is that a lot of that established generation of builders and workers in that sector are nearing retirement, and we've got to have the next generation to come through. 

So we are at a critical juncture for our state now in terms of how do we meet an unprecedented skills crisis, but how do we make sure we capitalise on the opportunity? 

It would be scandalous in 10 or 20 years' time, we look back on this period in South Australia's history with unprecedented job opportunities, record job advertisements, historically low unemployment, and say we wasted the opportunity to support our next generation of South Australians into secure, well-paid jobs in priority areas for the state. 

Building subs, building a New Women's and Children's Hospital, working on the non-stop North-South Motorway, the biggest infrastructure project this state has ever had. Being part of rolling out a second year of teacher-led play-based learning. 

They are opportunities that our state only fully realises their true potential and benefit if the jobs they create are given to South Australians, and that's what this is all about today.

JOURNALIST: And this package obviously targets teaching builders. How have you identified that that's where you need to be spending this money?

BOYER: Well we know because of the big pipeline of work, we've got the commitment the state government's made to building new houses. 

We know we already have existing shortfall in terms of supply, and that demand is going to increase as years go on. Add on top of that the point that you made, which is right, we've got a lot reaching retirement age who are going to be out of the industry. 

It's about, I think, a couple of things. It's about making sure those who are at high school now understand the magnitude of the opportunity in these sectors. The work is really well paid, probably better than it's been paid for a long, long time. It's secure and there are a lot of opportunities to move up and sideways within that career. 

I think traditionally apprenticeships and VET careers have been unfairly characterised as being not as good as a university pathway, but also as being not very varied. You're going to get stuck on the tools doing the same thing every day. That's not true. It is a dynamic job. 

It's an opportunity to, in five or ten years, go and do a different thing. Start your own business. Work in the administration or management side of things. And this is what the younger generation, I think, wants to hear. Because we are speaking and trying to inspire a generation of young people now who will have five careers. 

Not one, five careers and it is incredibly competitive out there to convince high school age students to come and choose your own sector or your own profession.

So part of it, the role we need to play as governments, is offering the incentive but also making sure that the person who will stand in front of those kids when they start their apprenticeship and is teaching them has the skills and has the recent experience on the tools themselves.

JOURNALIST: And how many educators will this $10 million train?

BOYER: I’ll pass over to Andrew for this.

GILES: 300 additional educators, but it's going to have an impact on hundreds who are already in the workforce. One of the things that Blair was touching upon was the ageing nature of some of our trades workforce. 

We've got a similar issue when it comes to their training workforce. So encouraging people to stay in their roles is equally as important as getting more people in. But more than 300 we’ll be sure.

JOURNALIST: Can I have a chat with [indistinct]? Sorry, I've forgot your name.

JUSTIN BUSSE, TAFE SA: It’s Justin.

JOURNALIST: Justin. Justin, how long have you worked for TAFE for?

BUSSE: I've been at TAFE for eight years.

JOURNALIST: Yeah, and you've been in the industry for how long?

BUSSE: I’ve been, I started out in the construction industry as a 16-year-old, as a carpenter joiner. Moved into TAFE after five or 10 years being on the tools. I've now been in the VET sector for 25 years. So I started as hourly paid instructor, lecturing role, senior lecturer, education manager and now manage the construction trades.

JOURNALIST: So you would have a good idea about how the industry has changed over the years. Just talk us through how much demand is there at the moment for good tradies?

BUSSE: Well, there's a huge demand for good tradies on the tools, but also for, a huge demand for us as a training provider to have quality people in front of the class. 

We're dealing with a really strong mix of students these days, from school leavers to returning or older students coming in, mature age students, international students, so there's a big cohort that we're working with, and we've got a huge pipeline of apprentices coming through thanks to the government and all the initiatives. And it's kind of managing.

JOURNALIST: Okay, so now you've got all these apprentices coming through from other initiatives but the problem is you don't have the skilled teachers?

BUSSE: No, but we've done a project this year with the local labour here around a pay-to-learn program, so we've recruited eight lecturers or eight people direct from industry across a myriad of trades, and ran them through its 12-week intensive training and assessment program. 

Also some in-house collaboration and working with some students and other lecturers, mentoring. So they completed that in term two. Term three, they're now in class teaching, and really bringing some new vibrant learnings to students. So it's really positive for us.

JOURNALIST: Is the shortage purely because you've got more interest and more demand for tradespeople? The shortage of teachers, sorry?

BUSSE: I think so, but also the industry is really buoyant at the moment and there's a lot of money in industry, so to peel people back into the sector you've got to have a real passion to want to work with students, and that's what we're starting to see. 

People that have gone through their trade, have had that experience with TAFE or a private provider and want to do that education, or they've had apprentices in their own business, they now want to come and give back and give more back to the sector.

JOURNALIST: And trades are typically quite physical jobs and physical careers, is moving into more of an educator role, as one progresses in their career, is that a good option as far as staying in the industry once the physical work gets a bit arduous?

BUSSE: Yeah, it is. Like me, I could kind of envisage I didn't want to be on the tools for the next 50, 60 years. So TAFE is a really good opportunity to come in and not have that stress of the work, but it's another kind of stress. 

You're working with young kids, we've got a lot of quality we've got to stay with. So there is, but it's a great job. And the opportunities within the TAFE and the private providers is great for those people. 

So we’re always looking for people to come in and do good things for our students and pass on knowledge and skills.

JOURNALIST: And Justin, just how much is this funding going to help you?

BUSSE: It's going to be really big. I mean it's 300 places. So we're booming here in Adelaide and in the regions so we really want to get people in the sector and really providing that education that we need to support all the projects that are happening. 

AUKUS is going to be massive, they're all big projects for us so we need the people to come in and train people in the right way.

JOURNALIST: Everyone wants to be in Adelaide at the moment. It’s bloody annoying –

BUSSE: The weather –

BOYER: I won't take that personally –

JOURNALIST: I've just got some other questions on other matters for Minister Boyer, if that's alright.

Just on LIV Golf, is the Government confident that it's got the broad support of the Kaurna community to disturb areas of the North Adelaide golf course, which may hold Indigenous heritage?

BOYER: Yes, I saw an update from the Deputy Premier Kyam Maher on this morning. I understand he has approved works there, but with very, very strict conditions, particularly in some parts of the course, which we know are really culturally sensitive to Kaurna people. 

I understand that those conditions are so tight in some of those places that will basically only allow for maintenance work, so things like lawn mowing to occur, not the kind of work that might involve disturbing culturally sensitive places that are on that course. 

So, Kyam being the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, I think has looked at this very, very closely and the authorisations have been made with a real lens to making sure that we are sensitive towards those cultural sites that are there on the course.

JOURNALIST: There was a lot of hurt from the broader Kaurna community over the discovery of remains at the Riverlea House in development. Are you worried the Government's sending a message that development trumps Indigenous heritage?

BOYER: Well no, I think if you have a look at the way that these authorisations have been considered and ultimately granted by the Deputy Premier and Aboriginal Affairs Minister, I think you'll see that we've had a very, very laser focus upon being able to balance those two things around the development of the course being able to go ahead, but those sites which we know are really culturally sensitive and important to the Kaurna people that are on that course being preserved. 

And those conditions, I understand, are really tight and in some cases will only permit basically routine maintenance like lawn mowing to occur on those sites so that nothing is disturbed. So, no, I understand the hurt at Riverlea, but I think what has been done here and the consideration made by the Government and the Deputy Premier has taken all that into account.

JOURNALIST: Have there been any changes that you’ve implemented since the discovery of those remains at Riverlea?

BOYER: I'd probably have to refer that to the Deputy Premier sorry.

JOURNALIST: Will the public be notified if Indigenous remains are discovered during the redevelopment of the North Adelaide Golf Course?

BOYER: Again, that's a question for the Deputy Premier I'll have to take that one on notice, sorry.

JOURNALIST: What will happen to any remains that are found on the golf course?

BOYER: One for Kyam Maher as well. But what I can say is all those things are part of the considerations that he has had to make and the Government has had to make before approving any authorisations for work on this [indistinct]. 

So these are not things that we are not alive to or considering. We absolutely are. And I think we are making sure that we strike an appropriate balance between allowing the works to continue but preserving those sites and giving confidence to the Kaurna community that we take their concerns very, very seriously as we absolutely should.

JOURNALIST: And could you tell me then if the remains would be reburied on site and taken elsewhere?

BOYER: Sorry that's a question for the Aboriginal Affairs Minister.

JOURNALIST: No worries. I do have a couple questions from Parliament, sorry, from the Canberra Parliament office.

BOYER: Yep, no problems.

JOURNALIST:  Just on the bullying. The Federal Government’s announced it will commit $10 million to support a new national plan to address bullying in Australian schools. Is that enough?

BOYER: Well that's just the Federal Government's contribution. That doesn't take into account what state and territory governments put in every single day. 

I mean we invest a lot as a state government here in South Australia to try to address bullying, in terms of the prevention of it. And we've done more in this term of government than I think any government before us in terms of wellbeing supports, mental health support, banning mobile phones in high schools. We have the strongest ban in Australia. 

We have seen the kind of negative things that occur through use of a smart device plummet. I mean violent incidents in high schools have dropped for the first time in five years, and the kind of bullying that occurs through social media and mobile phones at schools has dropped as well. 

And on December 10 we're going to see Australia start the social media ban and that all commenced here in South Australia with work that Peter Malinauskas started. So we have been really focused on bullying. 

I welcome the contributions from the Federal Government. I think the meeting yesterday is reason for a lot of optimism for students and parents and grandparents who are trapped in a cycle of bullying, that they can understand that these are issues that are of the highest priority when education ministers meet around Australia.

JOURNALIST: Do you have those figures, not on you, but broad figures on those drops in bullying?

BOYER: Yes, absolutely. So critical incidents we measure all the time. It is a rolling data set of critical incidents that occur in our public schools, and it's opened up into a range of things. 

Of course one of those categories is things like violence and we're making sure post the mobile phone ban which came into effect in all public high schools in term three 2023, we've been watching those figures change and we are seeing a really strong effect from the ban including the first drop in violent incidents in high schools in this state in five years.

JOURNALIST: How much is that drop?

BOYER: I can find the exact figures, but I have put all this stuff out, as you’d expect me to do, because it is positive data for the state. But we are, I am more confident now than I was when we announced the ban that it was the right thing to do, and not just a ban during class time. 

But our ban is from the start of the school day until the end of the school day, including recess and lunchtime. And we've seen a huge increase in a return to the kind of traditional lunchtime activities that many of us would remember. 

Kicking footy, playing with friends, an increase in clubs. In fact, we've been almost caught unaware with students coming to leaders and saying, you need to put something on for us at lunchtime and recess to do because we're bored. 

And that's because there was a kind of slow decline where students doing those things, and ended up sitting down on a phone next to their friend who was sitting down next to them on their phone as well.

JOURNALIST: You mentioned the drop. So could you tell me how bad bullying is now among students in South Australia?

BOYER: Oh, listen, there is, bullying still occurs. I would not suggest otherwise. Bullying still occurs. And I think the challenges that have been brought to bear upon schools and upon families by social media has made combating bullying harder now than it has ever been, because it is perpetrated in ways that even 20 years ago you couldn't imagine. 

I mean we had a presentation yesterday at our National Education Ministers meeting from the eSafety Commissioner which was both fascinating and frightening. It spoke about the new ways that young people are using social media platforms to bully other students. 

It includes things like phoenixing, starting 15 accounts that are perpetrating or targeting one individual and then as one account is knocked off they've got another one ready to go. 

I mean it is insidious, it is there in that young person's life 24 hours a day, seven days a week, they can't escape it when they go home and there's no doubt that it is having an enormous influence on the really parlour state of young people's mental health. 

That's why the social media ban is so important. That's why we took action to ban mobile phones from high schools in this state.

JOURNALIST: Education is a state issue, so why is it important for the Federal Government to step in here with a national plan?

BOYER: Bullying is not just a state issue, bullying is an issue for both.

JOURNALIST: Education is a state issue.

BOYER: It is bullying [indistinct] –

JOURNALIST: [Indistinct] bullying in educational institutions comes under education which is a state issue.

BOYER: Well, except the funding is shared by federal and state governments.

JOURNALIST: Why did the Education Minister settle on a two-day time period for schools to initiate action following a bullying complaint as recommended in the review?

BOYER: Yeah, well I mean as you said, I think the answer's probably in the question. The team that led the rapid review who came around twice to South Australia and listened to parents that we had at forums here, and they decided that two days was the right amount of time. 

That's only a minimum. That's not to say schools have two days to respond, what it's saying is that it can't be any longer than that. I think a lot of our schools would respond far faster than that and that's what I would expect too. 

But I think to have a minimum expectation there for how long it takes schools to respond to an allegation of bullying is only a good thing.

JOURNALIST: And just going back to that previous question you said bullying’s not a state issue. Whose responsibility is it, then?

BOYER: Well, no, I’m saying it’s a state and a federal issue.

JOURNALIST: Thank you.

ENDS